The PS2 Backlog Committee Game Club Presents: No seriously, how the hell have I not played this yet?

[Phaseknox]

I'm absolutely loving Kuon. I'll have more to say about it in my year end reviews, so I won't really go into it more here since those are just around the corner. But I will say that anyone who enjoys the genre or more specifically the genre from that era ought to play it however they can. I guess I'm only referring to argyle and phase for the most part, but it's a really well made game that is familiar to the formula while feeling very unique at the same time.

I played it back when it originally came out, and really liked it. That’s why it was my #2 recommendation for you. Fatal Frame II: Crimson Butterfly was my #1 recommendation because I liked it a little more, it’s one of my favorite survival horror games.

[isthatallyougot]

I played it back when it originally came out, and really liked it. That’s why it was my #2 recommendation for you. Fatal Frame II: Crimson Butterfly was my #1 recommendation because I liked it a little more, it’s one of my favorite survival horror games.

Yeah ok, if you mentioned that I guess I forgot. I sold my (sealed) copy a little while back for a *stupid* amount, but I'm playing it via emulation, and it's been essentially flawless.

I also loved Fatal Frame 1 (minus the putrid voice work). I really like the 'camera obscura' combat as well as the overall tone. So, I'll definitely get to the rest of the series sooner or later .

[crimson_tide]

I know I know Izzy but it's just more complicated than I anticipated. I said moving to the back burner so I haven't put it there yet. Dabbled more in Chained Echoes and it has a bizarre mechanic with an Overdrive bar that requires you to be in an optimal zone on the bar for skills, defense and offense. It makes the scrubs too easy and the bosses too hard. I'm not feeling it. But I was dabbling since I have the baby this afternoon and JRPG s don't require that much attention. I want to give full attention to Sakuna to see if I can't get into a good flow with the farming because the combat feels really good every time I get to it. Glad you are enjoying Kwon !

[isthatallyougot]

I know I know Izzy but it's just more complicated than I anticipated. I said moving to the back burner so I haven't put it there yet. Dabbled more in Chained Echoes and it has a bizarre mechanic with an Overdrive bar that requires you to be in an optimal zone on the bar for skills, defense and offense. It makes the scrubs too easy and the bosses too hard. I'm not feeling it. But I was dabbling since I have the baby this afternoon and JRPG s don't require that much attention. I want to give full attention to Sakuna to see if I can't get into a good flow with the farming because the combat feels really good every time I get to it. Glad you are enjoying Kwon !

I'm just playing crim. Play what you're enjoying. Don't force it because of this thing.

[argyle]

So....A Hat In Time. Hrm.

I played through the first chapter of it, which consists of 5 or 6 "levels". It's broken up like SMB64 where you will complete one goal, it will kick you out of the level, and you then select another "level" or goal and it will put you back in. I didn't care for this setup in SMB64, and my feelings haven't changed. But that is honestly the least of this game's problems.

The controls are very "not good". The camera was an absolute nightmare at first, then after digging in the options a bit I found a setting that is on by default, "camera assist mode", that is of the devil. Basically it makes the camera constantly swing around to be behind you as you move your character around. The word "nauseating" comes to mind. Turning that off made it playable, but it still wasn't good. Moving the right stick left & right rotates the camera around you, as you would expect. However, moving it up & down does NOT tilt the camera up & down, it zooms in & out on your character. Why? I'm not sure anyone asked the question "why" a lot when designing this game, so I wouldn't recommend you do either. Suffice to say that years & years of motor memory telling my right hand to tilt the stick to tilt the camera means I am CONSTANTLY zooming in & out. Not a good time. Even if the camera were perfect - and again, it's a long, long way away from that - your character feels like she doesn't have any mass at all. Very floaty, and you just don't feel like you're ever connecting with anything. It's hard to describe, but it's one of those feel things - when you play a 3D platformer that's done right, it just feels right. This never does.

So what are you trying to do anyway? I'm not sure I could tell you. You start out in a spaceship, but it doesn't look much like one. You make your way to the "bridge" by just fumbling around - the game doesn't tell you anything, unless it's been long enough that you would have had to have figured it out for yourself by then anyway - and there's this cut scene where this guy comes up to the outside window of your ship and demands you pay some kind of toll. When I say he comes up to the window, I mean a human-looking guy literally just walks/floats/whatever up to the window and starts talking to you. No ship, no space suit, nothing. After a short conversation, he breaks the window & all of your magic hour glasses - which they call fuel - fly out the window & down the planet.

So you choose the first level & go down to the planet. Now you're in a weird city-type area with a lot of guys wandering around that look just like the guy from the cut scene. Some of them just stand around and talk, a few of them will attack you - there's no rhyme or reason to which will happen. When they talk, they all call themselves Mafia, and they speak in a weird Russian-esque accent. I don't think I need to say this at this point, but the voice acting sucks - I think they know it too, because there's at item you can buy at one of the shops that changes all the dialog into "gibberish" speak. Anyway, in addition to these guys there are some little black round things w/ eyes & legs running around. These WILL attack you, and at this point you have two attacks, a punch which is worthless and a jump-dive attack. Whenever you punch something you get stuck in this too-long animation like she hurt her fist. You find out later that's because you get a weapon eventually but again the game never tells you this up front. I really don't know how to describe the insanity of this area you're in. There's stuff thrown everywhere for no apparent reason at all. I know these 3D platformers are usually silly - I've played a TON of them in my life, I know how they work. But they also usually have some kind of internal logic where things make sense in the game world. There is NONE of that here. After running around a short while this blonde girl with a mustache calls out to you from the top of a tower & tells you to come to see her. But there's no obvious route to get to her, so you end up having to just fumble around the level until you eventually get to the top of the tower - at which point, she runs away. You chase her down a few times, and she finally joins you to get rid of the "mafia" and do whatever else you're supposed to do - collect the hour glasses or whatever. After a few more levels you end up beating an easy boss and you have another cut scene with her (the blonde). I'm just gonna link to this one, I don't think I can do it justice:


(click the "Watch On YouTube" link, the timestamp doesn't seem to be working quite right if you just click play)

So...your character is mute, guess I should have mentioned that. And as you can see in that cut scene, it makes the game make even less sense. It's not like the blonde wants to do anything EVIL, but your character doesn't want to use the hour glasses to help her because of...reasons? That we can't know, because SHE WON'T SPEAK!

Listen, I know I'm following Crim here and bailing on my chosen game, but in my defense I wouldn't have played it as long as I did if not for our agreement here. And hey, it did get me to finally TRY the game - I just hate it! I'm honestly not sure why it gets any praise, IMO you'd have to have never played a 3D platformer in your life to find anything redeeming in this game. If anyone wants a modern FUN 3D platformer, may I suggest New Super Lucky's Tale? That game is amazing.

[jfissel]

Well, that is a bummer for sure but thanks for trying it and giving us a lengthy write-up. The trailer looked so cool, guess they fooled people.

[isthatallyougot]

Yeah, sorry it was so disappointing argyle (and crim, to a lesser extent, I guess). It's amazing that the game has such a positive reception on Steam. Maybe this one just wasn't for you, although you've enumerated plenty of reasons to dislike it. Maybe many people who played it didn't grow up playing 3D platformers like we did as well. FWIW, I'm happy to vote again whenever anyone wants to do this again. We could keep this as an ongoing thread without having everyone getting their lists ranked at the same time as far as I'm concerned. In fact, it might be easier if everyone just jumped in as they wished so that everyone wouldn't be drowning in considering so many different games by all of us at the same time. Just my 2 cents.

I think I'm getting close to finished with Kuon. I'm surely nearing the end of the Yang phase, and I don't know if there's anything after that, but it has really been an excellent game for me. There are some issues, as there are with most all games, but the overall experience has been great. I'll definitely finish it up in time to include it in my year end rankings / reviews. (I'll probably share those at the beginning of January if I can get everything together by then.) Maybe I'll even have time to squeeze one more in.

[canedaddy]

Well, that is a bummer for sure but thanks for trying it and giving us a lengthy write-up. The trailer looked so cool, guess they fooled people.

My thoughts exactly. Thanks for giving it a go, argyle!

crim, sorry you didn't have the fortitude to become a high-level virtual rice farmer.

[argyle]

Yeah, sorry it was so disappointing argyle (and crim, to a lesser extent, I guess). It's amazing that the game has such a positive reception on Steam. Maybe this one just wasn't for you, although you've enumerated plenty of reasons to dislike it. Maybe many people who played it didn't grow up playing 3D platformers like we did as well. FWIW, I'm happy to vote again whenever anyone wants to do this again. We could keep this as an ongoing thread without having everyone getting their lists ranked at the same time as far as I'm concerned. In fact, it might be easier if everyone just jumped in as they wished so that everyone wouldn't be drowning in considering so many different games by all of us at the same time. Just my 2 cents.

I think I'm getting close to finished with Kuon. I'm surely nearing the end of the Yang phase, and I don't know if there's anything after that, but it has really been an excellent game for me. There are some issues, as there are with most all games, but the overall experience has been great. I'll definitely finish it up in time to include it in my year end rankings / reviews. (I'll probably share those at the beginning of January if I can get everything together by then.) Maybe I'll even have time to squeeze one more in.

I believe my copy of the Star Ocean 2 remake is supposed to be arriving today, and I'm anxious to start that one given all the good I've heard about it (and the fact that what I played of the original release was the most fun I've had from the Star Ocean series ever). I'll juggle it & SW for now - when I finish one or both of those up, I'll probably put up a list of some of the Metroidvanias in my backlog I've been wanting to get to. There are a LOT.

[crimson_tide]

Oh I know you kid Izzy . But I'd like to follow though whenever I can. I have dug a little deeper into Sakuna. I kinda hate her. She's an obnoxious brat. So seeing Sakuna not be a little **** at some point will be nice. The rice farming is not really my jam since it's just a bunch of monotonous mini games but that is clearly the point. Rice farming is hard. They do a meticulous job of getting that across. Sakuna being frustrated makes sense because she's never had to do the farming so I like that. Like the old man said though, I just might not have the balls for it right now . It's deep and the combat is really great, I just want more of it. I really do recommend it if the game goes on sale for $20 or less or if you are a sucker like me and have....ummm...the second tier of PS Plus? Extra? They named it terribly.

As for Chained Echoes, if I am going to put that one aside. Yes one guy made it but it is a seriously buggy mess. If I am going to turn based JRPG it, I'll be going back to something like Trails or Nocturne. I need to actually work on clearing this backlog .

I had the same issue with Mario 64 and everyone told me that I was crazy! I knew you I liked you for a reason argyle . I thought it was such a lame mechanic. I guess everyone likes Hat in Time because of nostalgia? And is one of your search action games the Record of Lodoss War one? I am nipping at that one but it's not grabbed me yet.